UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

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gdh82
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby gdh82 » Sat May 10, 2008 2:08 pm

Seems as good as time as any....

As agreed I'd like to re-open the discussion on the recent UKC tournament settings :

- autoslides off (deactivated)
- slide bug off (fixed)


I'm particularly interested to hear the views of those people who attended the UKCs and their experience of how the above tournament settings affected their matches.

My point of view is really simple.

1) I didn't seek these settings to gain personal advantage - I don't believe it favours any one group of players tbh.

2) I want to tackle for and/or head the ball when I press the button, and not via a computer assisted quasi-random intervention.

3) I want to trap the ball when I want to trap the ball, and not only when I've touched the ball last, nor only if I do it as part of a continuous running action!

For me, both 2 and 3 add to the pleasure of the game, giving all players greater control of their players. They enhance the virtues of the game - the simplicity of the control and immediacy of the action. I certainly wasn't aware of any complaints during the UKC's as a result of these settings.

Without these measures, imho, the game is tainted by unnecessary 'auto slide/slide bug' interruptions in play through fouls and/or the ball going out of play. These things still happen of course but at least when they do, I know they're the result of my own joystick actions.

IMHO the game has no less drama nor becomes more robotic as a result of these changes. The depth of the great game (player attributes, ball and pitch physics, refereeing decisions, goal keeping behaviour and of course, human error) ensure this.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Steve1977 » Sat May 10, 2008 4:55 pm

I said before the UK Champs that having auto slides in benefits the better player and I still stand by this. With them taken out it's perhaps of no suprise that someone like myself managed to finish 4th. Would this have occured with AutoSlides turned on? Its difficult to say but I will say this... if you gain an advantage of an auto slide over someone then it's no different than A>B. It's a cheap way to win.

When I played an online game the other day it was amazing how bizarre the game felt with players diving off into all manner of directions, it just seemed so random. Whereas at the UK Champs they were taken out and there were just as many talking points (if not more), we had a cracking finale, players still cracked and mistakes were made, but this random element...this artifact that would turn off most new players (auto slides? wtf? relic of old games, im going back to Pro Evo where this doesent happen) had been cast aside.

When Waynie and Stainy were playing a friendly with Autoslides turned on, the game seemed a little...well...off. It did seem like a bug but obviously we know it isnt.

Of course it's upto any given persons perception as to what should be taken out the game. For instance Durban would like the goal keepers to be fixed whereas I wouldnt and whilst it's true that Auto Slides are not a bug, then neither was A>B and we all know that by having A=B, it made for equal games which meant that any one person didnt get an unfair advantage - which is preciesly what happens when a player decides to take an auto slide.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Bounty Bob » Sat May 10, 2008 8:34 pm

Steve1977 wrote:this artifact that would turn off most new players (auto slides? wtf? relic of old games, im going back to Pro Evo where this doesent happen) had been cast aside.
Steve, what new players are coming to KO2 that didn't play it in it's original state? In Pro Evo and FIFA, your players will do things that aren't of a benefit.

Relic of old games? Of course it is, it's how many years old???

I spend an awful lot of time playing modern football games and they are great fun. I come back to KO2 because it's what it is. It isn't realistic, it has its quirks but it is a lot of fun. You talk about relics of old games, well what about the stupid amounts of curl you can put on the ball? What about the way you can jump for a header and change direction in mid air when you contact the ball? What about the way your forwards will run half a mile offside? What about blind referees? What about referees that send a player off after two fouls regardless of severity? As for the keeper going behind the goal, so what? They run through the damn nets FFS!! And on the subject of the goalies, how far do they dive? And do they have some kind of super non-stick oiled up goal keepers jersey? They slide miles once they've hit the ground. What about players that run through other players? And don't get me started on PBD where for some strange reason the control of the ball changes but only when you're in the penalty area. What's that all about?

One other thing. Isn't it all great fun??
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby durban » Sat May 10, 2008 9:24 pm

Steve1977 wrote:For instance Durban would like the goal keepers to be fixed....


Nooo I never said that, I just wondered whether it was possible to 'fix' this as an option mate.

I have NEVER suggested that anything should be added or taken out of the game, I will put my opinion forward but I will never suggest anything honest!

:)

Just making that clear.

I just raise 'topics' I don't make decisions around here, never have, never will :)
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby gdh82 » Sun May 11, 2008 10:26 am

gdh82 wrote:As agreed I'd like to re-open the discussion on the recent UKC tournament settings :

- autoslides off (deactivated)
- slide bug off (fixed)


I'm particularly interested to hear the views of those people who attended the UKCs and their experience of how the above tournament settings affected their matches.


Just a gentle (and probably futile) reminder that I'd like this thread to be about feedback about these specific tournament settings! :)

All the goalie and realism arguments are better placed in Durban's thread...
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Steve1977 » Sun May 11, 2008 5:51 pm

Bounty Bob wrote:
Steve1977 wrote:
One other thing. Isn't it all great fun??


Never a truer word spoken :) Since I found this place last year I'v had some fantastic times.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby gdh82 » Mon May 12, 2008 7:54 am

Bounty Bob wrote:One other thing. Isn't it all great fun??


Completely agree too, BBob.

And having the autoslides off/slidebug fixed avoids the unnecessary interruptions in play, allowing for more KO2 and even more fun! :)
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Bounty Bob » Mon May 12, 2008 9:29 am

Glad you enjoy it.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Bounty Bob » Mon May 12, 2008 9:38 am

Steve1977 wrote:When I played an online game the other day it was amazing how bizarre the game felt with players diving off into all manner of directions, it just seemed so random.


Steve1977 wrote:When Waynie and Stainy were playing a friendly with Autoslides turned on, the game seemed a little...well...off. It did seem like a bug but obviously we know it isnt.

It sounds like you're actually saying that the game feels massively different without auto slides. This is the feeling I got from the tournaments I played without them and why I won't play any more tournaments with this change in gameplay.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Bounty Bob » Mon May 12, 2008 9:39 am

gdh82 wrote:Seems as good as time as any....

As agreed I'd like to re-open the discussion on the recent UKC tournament settings :

- autoslides off (deactivated)
- slide bug off (fixed)


I'm particularly interested to hear the views of those people who attended the UKCs and their experience of how the above tournament settings affected their matches.

My point of view is really simple.

1) I didn't seek these settings to gain personal advantage - I don't believe it favours any one group of players tbh.

2) I want to tackle for and/or head the ball when I press the button, and not via a computer assisted quasi-random intervention.

3) I want to trap the ball when I want to trap the ball, and not only when I've touched the ball last, nor only if I do it as part of a continuous running action!

For me, both 2 and 3 add to the pleasure of the game, giving all players greater control of their players. They enhance the virtues of the game - the simplicity of the control and immediacy of the action. I certainly wasn't aware of any complaints during the UKC's as a result of these settings.

Without these measures, imho, the game is tainted by unnecessary 'auto slide/slide bug' interruptions in play through fouls and/or the ball going out of play. These things still happen of course but at least when they do, I know they're the result of my own joystick actions.

IMHO the game has no less drama nor becomes more robotic as a result of these changes. The depth of the great game (player attributes, ball and pitch physics, refereeing decisions, goal keeping behaviour and of course, human error) ensure this.

Nobody will ever complain that they aren't happening but that doesn't make it betteror make it right.

Saying the gameplay is tainted is interesting. What drew you to the KOA? Did you come along thinking this might be fun, shame about the tainted game? Or did you arrive here remembering how much you loved playng KO2 and what good times you had?
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby durban » Mon May 12, 2008 9:43 am

Nah I am still adamant that Autoslides SAVE your ass as much as they give away penalties.

I reckon in an average tournament with 15 players an Autoslide penalty happens about 10 times in total.

So thats 0.70 per person.

I reckon in an average tournament and autoslide makes a great tackle stopping a 'possible' goal about 100 times, so thats about 7.0 times per person.

These stats are made up, but I reckon they are about right on average....and yet you NEVER hear anyone shouting OH FOR F**** SAKE COX HAS JUST AUTOSLID WITH 5 SECONDS LEFT AND CLEARED THE BALL OFF THE LINE FOR ME!!!!

:)

But saying that, I can honestly say I didn't even notice the difference in the UK Champs, although there were points I was sure the Autosliding bastards were doing it to spite me :) :) :)

M
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Bounty Bob » Mon May 12, 2008 9:59 am

durban wrote:These stats are made up, but I reckon they are about right on average....and yet you NEVER hear anyone shouting OH FOR F**** SAKE COX HAS JUST AUTOSLID WITH 5 SECONDS LEFT AND CLEARED THE BALL OFF THE LINE FOR ME!!!!

:)
I don't know about your stats but completely agree with your point. People always remember the negatives far more easily than the positives. I play a lot of poker and the amount of times I hear people talking about ow they always get beat on the river is crazy. They never seem to remember winning on the river card, or all the times that the odds work in their favour and the other person doesn't get lucky.
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Re: UK Championships 2008 | Birmingham | Discussion

Postby Steve1977 » Mon May 12, 2008 10:08 am

Bounty Bob wrote:
Steve1977 wrote:When I played an online game the other day it was amazing how bizarre the game felt with players diving off into all manner of directions, it just seemed so random.


Steve1977 wrote:When Waynie and Stainy were playing a friendly with Autoslides turned on, the game seemed a little...well...off. It did seem like a bug but obviously we know it isnt.

It sounds like you're actually saying that the game feels massively different without auto slides. This is the feeling I got from the tournaments I played without them and why I won't play any more tournaments with this change in gameplay.


Yeah, it was kind of strange. I remember when I along with Sid and yourself went along to Grahams and on that night there was loads of em! I do prefer them off but if I host a tournament and it will affect yourself coming Mark then I'l be sure to put them back in - saying that though I'v had them out the past three times and over chrimbo you wanted to add a new round of fixtures! :D

But essentially, I prefer them out, but not fussed if people want them back in.
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